Alice Dungeon Feedback

SpaceHelm

So, after long time, i finally tried Alice Dungeon Normal duo with my friends
We clear the first map, pretty quick, but then come the biggest time consuming problem ever
we cant go forward for a whole 20 minutes, because of the warp rng.

even got the time limit warning (said my friend)

we ended clearing with only 5 minute left ..

The point of the dungeon, is bassicly walking simulator, what makes it even worse, is that the feeling of walking really slow because of the fixed movespeed.

i wonder what is the purpose of the dungeon design, which led only 90% of the dungeon by walking.
the time waste by the rng portal , and doing nothing but walking is really pain. its like pointless of doing it.
would hope if there is anything that can be done, to avoid this feeling of "emptyness" while doing that.

Musashi

Yeah, especially when the end rewards are time limited as far as I can remember. When you get that extremely late warning, the end rewards are reduced by half iirc. Which is a baffling idea when the warps are determined by RNG. The worst example I got was when a path lead to the large maze, whose end lead to another path, which then led to the outer ring of the large maze, whose end lead to the first path. I was stuck in that loop for about 10 minutes until I randomly got warped to another path.

I would personally suggest, at the moment you get that 'late' warning. The next portal you take in the starting area will warp you to the 6th outermost path you need to progress to the clock.

GMIcecold

Hello, this instance is made to push party play, especially the hard mode, which needs 3 different dps types.

Yes, the portals are random and yes the walking speed is limited (it was harder before).

If you manage to have a good amount of players in your party, only a few need to reach the npc.

Party leader can then warp the whole party (doesn't matter if they are dead or not) to mvp fight.
You need always 50% of the party +1 player to warp the party.

Example:

10 players in party = 6 players at npc to warp the whole party.

7 players in party = 4 players necessary

That's really usefull, I also run with my private chars every day Alice (normal and hard mode) and we don't face those problems you mention above.

Another tip:

For hard mode it's good to note down where the portals are, one day you will have the coordinates from all of them and everyone can pick one walk direct to them to check where the portal is, instead of all walking chaotic in the maze.

SpaceHelm

GMIcecold Party leader can then warp the whole party (doesn't matter if they are dead or not) to mvp fight.

GMIcecold 10 players in party = 6 players at npc to warp the whole party.

dont forget its needed to include the Party Leader on those part to teleport the rest of the party..

yeah then what happened if the Party Leader stuck on the first map because of the bad rng?

GMIcecold Hello, this instance is made to push party play, especially the hard mode, which needs 3 different dps types.

i mean im not complaining about the 3 types of damage ( magic, melee, ranged ) needed, but morely the rng needed to really complete the dungeon.
im pretty sure there are better dungeon to be implemented, rather than putting the rng there. (even worse, because there are no pity for it) , so its really possible for the party leader (who responsible to teleport people) to really stuck outside , and the rest of party cant goes forward the boss.

what people can do to getting better at this dungeon? no gear / no skill , but just need luck? i really feel thats not a great game design, morely in an instance. since i really have no idea or sense why the rng needed to finish the instance quicker.

GMIcecold Yes, the portals are random and yes the walking speed is limited (it was harder before).

like what is really the main point of making the portal random? im pretty sure, no one really enjoy the part of walking and pray you got the right rng, even when you do it with all of ur friends

i heard people saying, GM dont want it to be finished quicker ..
then design something that people need to do outside of be on the "rng" gaming. either that requires "gear" or "skill".
make a dps check dummy for gear , or some minigames that requires "skills".
and please not rng or even "timed" conversation (like GMT that is full of npc conversation),

GMIcecold

SpaceHelm

You can change the party leader while in instance, right now it's buggy, we will fix that.

I don't know why you all have such a problem with Alice? I'm running it with a full party and we all have fun while that, laughing together, cuz someone has to run the special map without monsters for nothing, laughing while only physical dps are ahead and die to the flowers.

Portals are random yes, but 2 players who walk together through the portal get warped together to the next point, so you are not alone. You can also use that to splitt up in good teams, physical and magic dps or dps with a supporter class.

There are a lot of ways to make this instance easier, you just have to figure out and don't "just run it and hope".

SpaceHelm

GMIcecold You can change the party leader while in instance, right now it's buggy, we will fix that.

oh i didnt know if it's was a bug, thanks for letting me know.

GMIcecold I don't know why you all have such a problem with Alice? I'm running it with a full party and we all have fun while that, laughing together, cuz someone has to run the special map without monsters for nothing, laughing while only physical dps are ahead and die to the flowers.

surely i dont have the problem with the full instance of Alice, all of the other mechanics there, i have no problem of. its just particularly the random portal. which really time consuming with no point, other than just delaying the time needed for the completion.

GMIcecold I'm running it with a full party and we all have fun while that, laughing together, cuz someone has to run the special map without monsters for nothing, laughing while only physical dps are ahead and die to the flowers.

This part tbh, ofc is different from person to person. Eventhough most of the case it wont be that much of fun when we are doing it with people that we dont know. since ofc, anything can be fun when u do it with close friends, but it still doesnt really answer the quality design of something.

GMIcecold Portals are random yes, but 2 players who walk together through the portal get warped together to the next point, so you are not alone. You can also use that to splitt up in good teams, physical and magic dps or dps with a supporter class.

and here again, u mentioned about the solution of variety of the damage type needed / class variety needed, which is good solution so u dont walk alone. (and so people dont Solo this content, as i said, that it is good mechanic)

GMIcecold There are a lot of ways to make this instance easier, you just have to figure out and don't "just run it and hope".

but really no solution for the luck needed to land on the right portal right? what we need to figure it out, so i can to land on the portal faster? nothing tbh.. this is where i feel like the problem is. And if i really have bad luck that day, then hope my friends have better luck? which is back to "just run and hope".

Muh

SpaceHelm There are talks to add some kind of pity system to the portals

GMIcecold

SpaceHelm

I updated the wiki with the informations I mentioned here, so at least you have a lil bit time saving
https://wiki.muhro.eu/Alice_Twisted_Madness#Hard_Mode