Forgoten Time Daily Quest Rewards

brozenwall

Choi As presented in my math, The goal is not make everything unrewarded. Those extra ways to get the items to progress will still be there. I see it from the point of view of someone who like RO and play limited time.

Even with dailies quest rates 3x and exchange 3 to 1, it will take about 4 months of progression. Just to hit the RNG wall that can stuck you for another 1-3 months. Also progression is tie to Weekly HoL and the level you beat it each week.

The real question here is "How much time it will take a casual player to reach that point the RNG Wall?"

As presented in my multiple calculation it can be from 4.5 months to 14 months.

With things how are now for a casual player it will take 14 months you invest extra time it will be reduce.

Choi

brozenwall Hmm but your calculation is only taking into account the daily quest as a means to obtain the Energies. However, as I mentioned, the Daily quest is not the only way to obtain them nor are they the best way. If we include that the players can use the Attribute energy Exchange, it should cut down the time significantly

EvilLumi

brozenwall Casual players seem to be ignored most of the time when referring to end-game content, because apparently, that's not considered for casual players, according to some in our community. This same thing happened in talonro, causing a lot of players to leave, because someone without the time investment just could not see the light at the end of the endless tunnel which was practically 6+ months. Stopping reasonable progress can outright just make people quit, and has. I'm not really sure why this craze is being pushed, and I don't quite understand anything at all lately, but thank you for considering what someone with a limited time investment could achieve, because those people are always offered excuses and not real solutions.

brozenwall

Choi Player will still be gated by LoF Drops
and HoL Mats.

I'm the no life player that will use all different avenues to get my gear ASAP. I'm thinking about the guy that is not like me.

I have about 16 months here. I have seen may people join and disappear, I have talk with many others and they take about 2 months to reach endgame. Then we gonna tell those people that they have 2 paths to get his final pieces of gear. Farm Slowly for 14 months or become a NO Life player like me.

Also if you point is that the best way to engage with a new content is not doing the new content (AKA doing old instance and buy mats) that is a WILD take.

Eneru

As a somewhat casual player myself i try to not stress over HoL. It's new enjoyable content so far, but yes, it seems a pretty too far away goal as of now.

Playing with only one char makes it harder too.

Josh

While I think the amount of time and commitment it takes to farm all the Mats from the Dungeon, LoF and HoL to get the max enchanted equipment from Garden of Time is a joke (A Joke that works for kRO cause they got thousands of players and you can literally buy the mats for cheap zeny at the vending market…) I also would like to drop this in here:

As up to Chapter1 (,,the new Episode 22 on kRO if you want to call it so) nothing better has been added to even kRO. So even now, with Chapter 1 on the horizon, you will not replace your Hall of lIfe Accessory nor your Hall of Life Garment anytime soon with new gears that are better than this 2 pieces.

Even if something better might come with Patch Chapter 1.5 or Chapter 2.0, we wont see it on MuhRO for like 2 Years I guess? (Expecting to see Episode 21 by the end of this year and Episode 1 somehwere around mid June 2026?). So we got time and we dont need to rush, as there is nothing else waiting for us after HoL BiS Gear.

However, I think most of our current player wont ever see BiS Enchanted gear here, cause many will quit long time before they get all the mats to success throught this rediculous RNG Wall (6% for right enchant on the acc, and after that up to 25% chances for upgrade….) or simple burn out trying.

PS: My main source of getting the Energy of Element is farming OGH Normal/Hard/Challenge/Fall of GH with the power of my 15 Biolo alt slaves daily 😃 - I dont care for the Dungeon Daily cause the time amount it takes to kill the (M) Monsters is … well.. a choice made). So make more Alts and enjoy the Progress ^_^

brozenwall

This is excellent. Here we have the 2 extremes.

Josh the MadLad with his 15 Biolos farming instances and will buy the mats in record time.
&
Eneru the GigaChad that plays 1 character very casually.

Josh doesn't eve care about the daily quest and he will still farm the content as fast as possible so should we punish Eneru with making him take 14 months just to reach the same content?

My proposal of "3x the rewards and a 3 to 1" exchange will not affect Josh at all but will aloud Eneru to participate in the content at a reasonable pace.

cruro

Currently my overall-thoughts are:

Having goals than cannot be reached easily is generally good thing to keep players engaged long-term (see HoL enchants)
Having progression RNG-gated generally feels frustrating as two players inputting the same amount of effort can receive very different outcomes (see LoF random spawn + not guaranteed drops)
Ideally progression should be logarhitmic, meaning that putting lots of effort brings good results, but going further beyond will have highly diminishing returns. This makes things reasonable for casual players, but still gives endgame players possibilities to work on something for a slight edge. Having a reasonable progression for more casual players also benefits endgame players, as they get more reliable party members for group content like the Rigel fight.

Unfortunately most endgame gears don't work like that at all. Many items are borderline worthless until grade A, where they start surpassing every other option by a mile. In the case of HoL we see some of the best enchants being put at the very end of the progression.
This causes a big gap between players that are 95% of the way there and those that are 100% finished with their enchants. This gap is IMO the biggest reason why it causes such an urge to rush this content and feel miserable in the process.

That being said, I'm really unsure what a good solution would look like. Changing the way item progression works would be a huge customization and may make us "incompatible" with future changes.

I mostly resonate with the 1:1 exchange, since it would basically "normalize" not getting the right boss to spawn (some may not see their prefered boss in 10 runs, others may get it multiple times in a row = frustrating), but I can't deny that it would make things easier again. Then again, LoF drops seem to be mostly used to initially create the garment and put lv1 enchants, so it would help with the start, but not really take away the grind that follows after that.

CongaLyne

cruro I completely agree with what you're saying here.

Logarithmic progress makes sense but for some reason Gravity's had this obsession recently with having gear be very end loaded for useful benefits.
Dim Glacier Mufflers, HoL enchants, Moan of Corruption, etc, there's a lot of items that are usually so-so until you max them out all the way.

It feels like you need to sprint to the very end for items to be useful which is unsatisfying for casual players since it demands more time than most are willing to commit while feeling like a letdown for hardcore players since due to the expectation that people will need to max equipment out; it has to be a lot easier to max out gear by design to make sure everyone can reach it.

I'm not going to get into the RNG progression gravity also seems addicted to lately since I feel confident nobody's going to defend it outside of the sake of being a devil's advocate, but a problem with this all being from KRO is the fact it's from KRO, the source server.

What are we meant to do? Deviate away from the official method of obtaining these gears to make it more satisfying for everyone involved?
Rework items to reward benefits in a logarithmic way?
I don't know if either of these would be popular ideas, especially the latter and if you aren't already setting the premise that your server does things differently from official; it's hard to think of an appropriate solution to the problem when official's the one causing problems.

brozenwall

This proposal is mostly a Help for the more casual players.

A player like me will mostly buy all the OGH Mats and craft 50.

hayatow

Bruh it feels like it's gonna take a year to get a good accessory enchant with all this grind. Any qol improvement to lessen the burden is appreciated.

brozenwall

Let me demonstrate how irrelevant the daily quest rewards are
As soon as you get your first enchant on the Garment to lvl 1.
You need exactly 162 mats (324 since 2 different mats) mats to get your enchant to lvl 10.

162 Mats means 81 days of doing daily quest.

324 x 6 x 90,000 = 174,960,000 Zeny
324 represent the the amount of Daily Rewards Mats needed.
6 is the sum of Coagulated Spell + Contaminated Magic
90,000 is the market value at the moment of Coagulated Spell and Coagulated Magic

In other words you can spend 175m vs do daily quest for 81 days.

Increasing the daily quest reward won't change anything when there is a better more efficient alternative.

dadalin212

brozenwall Increasing the daily quest reward won't change anything when there is a better more efficient alternative.

Then what's the point of of this suggestion? Reward players (casual or not) for not being smart in tackling the new content by taking the less efficient route when there are better alternatives?

With that said, I'm not opposed to the idea of increasing the reward or adjust the mob density for M-type monster related quests since at its current state it's simply too cumbersome and time-consuming and most players would opt to simply skip them (focusing on Serpen quests only). Though personally I'm speculating that we'll see some kind of adjustment regarding this matter in the upcoming maintenance.

Lastly, daily quests supplements your usual farm, not the other way around, using it as a metric to project progression and gauge difficulty makes little sense.

brozenwall

The point of the suggestion is to help more casual oriented players. Those who play less day per week and whey they do for not many hours.

hayatow

i can only farm like 100-200 polluted stuff a weekday and each token of life enchant needs 300. im not even mentioning stuff like the insane amount of fogh and oghc loot required to enchant and the little amount that we get a day. i could deal with it and maybe people will start vending them but, you know..up to what point?

dadalin212

hayatow

Currently not at the phase of making circulation of life accessory, but I can see why it raises concern as the enchantment process requires 30 grace of spirit per attempt at 6.5% chance of getting the desired signet…

I think increasing the OGHC drops (seems like temporal gemstone is the bottleneck) would be a better long term solution, but that's something Muh and his team has to decide on.

Sagii

I prefer gacha/rng. Why dont we add another option. Like a box with random necessary stuff inside. Can help to lessen the time needed. But that is just me.

Josh

6% for the right Enchant and the amount of time and zeny IT costs per try Killed my will to get the ACC. Its a pure disrespect of my Personal time.

I would rather have an fail Safe mechanism.

Like ,,4% more Chance next try" or even an Option that you can choose to Invest 10 time the amount needed for one try, but you can choose the Option you want to Enchant on it

I Had to do 32 tries to get my lvl 5 Enchant on my Stellar Seal. And that was dirty cheap, compared to what an try costs on the HoL Enchant. At this point, I rather opt Out and call IT a day.

As an Pserver WE have the Option to Change Stuff and make IT suitable for our Server and Economy. But I 100% accept, when the GM Team decides to stay Close to kRO No Matter what.

Generally spoken, and this is probably Just me crying, the way HoL got implemented Here and how IT IS currently, brought me to an Point, where I heavenly thinking about taking a Break from RO and probably come Back in 6 months or so, when my ,,Personal time" gets more respected aka I can Farm Zeny and Just buy the Mats on the Market for an reasonable price.

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